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i was taking a look at DJs mid mark chart and i was really looking at the grip height to bar height ratio. can someone confirm how acurate this ratio is? lets say i have a grip height of of 13'2, it says i should be able to clear 13'6 with that grip. well would i be able to clear 14 with this grip also even though it says to clear 14 you need a grip height of 13'5?

foreverforum8 wrote:i was taking a look at DJs mid mark chart and i was really looking at the grip height to bar height ratio. can someone confirm how acurate this ratio is? lets say i have a grip height of of 13'2, it says i should be able to clear 13'6 with that grip. well would i be able to clear 14 with this grip also even though it says to clear 14 you need a grip height of 13'5?

A good goal is to be able to beat the chart. The chart is a minimum height you should be able to clear with each grip, not a minimum grip needed to clear each height. You should grip at whatever height gets you landing safely in the middle of the pit, don't raise your grip just to clear a higher bar.

hye

the chart is highly accurate, by physics, for the average height that is jumped by each grip..

some athletes have jumped higher and some lower...

gold Medalist Tim Mack jumped 5.90m with a 5.00m grip.. a height above the grip average.. which put him "above average" in swing and clearance percentages...

speed-grip-jump height.. have a "circular" correlation…. the grip correlates to speed needed to move that grip to vertical…and speed correlates to jump height

There are always slight pluses and minus to any 'average" but Becca is correct in the fact you have to grip the height you can safely reach the pit and clear a bar.. preferably a bar with the standards set at 20 to 30 inches..

If you are gripping high penetrating safely into the pit and not clearing a bar close/near to the chart average vault per grip height, you likely have soon major technical errors.

A good goal is to be able to beat the chart.

Although a goal to "beat the chart" can be a good motivator... the chart was create from math/physics based on application of force...

speed on the runway creates the amount of "force" needed to move each grip to vertical …then pole speed and swing radius creates 'force" that creates height above grip..

I took two sets of numbers (bar height-grip and "MID" for 14 and 16 foot vaults)I knew to be true and mathematically created the rest of the chart.

sorry for the details but the chart sometimes is over though and misunderstood..

If you keep your vaulting near the numbers, grip -to bar height - to mid, give or take a little, you should progress into an efficient vaulter.

dj

So would you advise a high school vaulter to use this chart(only the grip to bar height ratio) for his vaults as long as he can move te grip to vertical?

I would use the chart every day to practice the appraoch on the track and every
vault session as a "tool" to correlate with the run, plant and swing...

when you have your best run and vault check the grip, mid.. see if it matches up...also check and see where you hit at the "MID" when your coach said you were stretching...

dj

dj wrote:I would use the chart every day to practice the appraoch on the track and every
vault session as a "tool" to correlate with the run, plant and swing...

when you have your best run and vault check the grip, mid.. see if it matches up...also check and see where you hit at the "MID" when your coach said you were stretching...

dj

i would do that except i train with Paul Babbits every once in a while and he has a different take on the mid mark....he thinks the mid never changes so thats how i have been doing it...my mid is always 43 and no matter where my grip is it always seems to work out

hye

quite honestly.. why the questions if you didn't need or want the answers!!!

seems a waste of time.

dj

dj wrote:hye

quite honestly.. why the questions if you didn't need or want the answers!!!

seems a waste of time.

dj

i said in the original post i was only looking at the grip to bar height ratio...i do not care about any of the other info...i was just very intrigued to that set of numbers and that is it

hey

The grip to vault height correlation was first the average of all the 14 and 16 foot vaulters I had trained over the years, or checked at meets AND every piece of vault research I could fined at the time I was formulating my "theory" and creating the chart, much of the research was from Richard Ganslen.

the grip to vault height has been very, very close for 30 years.

dj

From what ive put together after reading several posts about your mid chart, the actually stats were found for 14-16 ft vaulters and the rest of it based on those data, right?
would this mean that the data for lower heights (say 10-11 ft) if less accurate and mostly just a rough estimate, or is the data for lower heights still accurate?
Same goes for the mid-mark.

all have proven to be accurate over a 30 year period...

they are mathematically correct and have been correct from me checking the empirical data from all the vaulters I have checked in practice and in meets…

the differences we currently see in the vaulters, mainly "mids" to far out, means they are over striding… it also can mean their technique has not caught up with their speed.. BUTT by continuing with teaching, training and coaching that (stride lengths to long for the "speed" needed to move that grip)way you are developing the wrong feel, poor run -pole carry technique and even poor plant technique because of the over striding.

dj

So what is the science behind the 43' unchanging mid. It seems that if one's grip rises that one's approach would retreat by an equal length and so would the "mid". It seems that if it always works out then you are steering.

foreverforum8 wrote:

dj wrote:I would use the chart every day to practice the appraoch on the track and every
vault session as a "tool" to correlate with the run, plant and swing...

when you have your best run and vault check the grip, mid.. see if it matches up...also check and see where you hit at the "MID" when your coach said you were stretching...

dj

i would do that except i train with Paul Babbits every once in a while and he has a different take on the mid mark....he thinks the mid never changes so thats how i have been doing it...my mid is always 43 and no matter where my grip is it always seems to work out