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Worked a meet at Penn State this past week end and for the first time saw the new Gill Cross Bars in action. Just curious for those of you who have vaulted in competition with them in place what did you think. I thought they were pretty "forgiving" to the vaulters, but I also thought the bar section could have been about 2" longer so the end pieces were not just on the pegs by maybe the last 1.5". Several coaches and competitors commented that the bars would probably be "outlawed" because they were too forgiving. "We shortened the pegs, lets not give the vaulter any help"
OK just curious - what do you think?

Dan

drcurran wrote:Worked a meet at Penn State this past week end and for the first time saw the new Gill Cross Bars in action. Just curious for those of you who have vaulted in competition with them in place what did you think. I thought they were pretty "forgiving" to the vaulters, but I also thought the bar section could have been about 2" longer so the end pieces were not just on the pegs by maybe the last 1.5". Several coaches and competitors commented that the bars would probably be "outlawed" because they were too forgiving. "We shortened the pegs, lets not give the vaulter any help"
OK just curious - what do you think?

Dan

Yeah the only thing I don't like about them is that standards tend to vary a bit on how far apart they are from each other, depending on how they're installed, if they are leaning in at all, etc, and these crossbar ends are much less forgiving than a traditional cross bar.

Other than that I think they are awesome.

drcurran wrote:Several coaches and competitors commented that the bars would probably be "outlawed" because they were too forgiving.

rainbowgirl28 wrote:... and these crossbar ends are much less forgiving than a traditional cross bar.

Are these comments contradicting each other or am I missing something?

- master

master wrote:

drcurran wrote:Several coaches and competitors commented that the bars would probably be "outlawed" because they were too forgiving.

rainbowgirl28 wrote:... and these crossbar ends are much less forgiving than a traditional cross bar.

Are these comments contradicting each other or am I missing something?

- master

Sorry, I was being vague. The bars are slightly more forgiving in terms of staying up, as long as the standards are a standard distance apart. If the standards are too far apart, it's harder to put the crossbar up, because you can't just adjust the ends in and out.

Thanks for the clarification Becca.
I hadn't heard of or seen this crossbar so I finally went to the Gill site and grabbed this photo and text.

- master

"Several coaches and competitors commented that the bars would probably be "outlawed" because they were too forgiving"

The bar "shaft" itself is identical to the other version. The rules at every level have allowed for this type of end for years (10 plus as far as I can locate right now). They have just never been available until now. The benefits are obvious.

"Yeah the only thing I don't like about them is that standards tend to vary a bit on how far apart they are from each other, depending on how they're installed, if they are leaning in at all, etc, and these crossbar ends are much less forgiving than a traditional cross bar."

If your standards are not set properly for width and/or are not true to vertical you will have an issue with any bar. You should fix the standards so they are properly installed for the best performace. Crossbars have a minimum and maximum length to be legal. So if you are lengthing and shortening them beyond the rules then those bars are illegal regaurdless of what type of ends are used. We have had no indication from any orgaization that this bar/end will be written out of the rules. Since it has been a part of the rules for over 10 years but no one ever pursued the design it would seem odd if they just now realized that they dont like the design.

This might be an ignorant question, but won't the top of the bar sit lower than a traditional crossbar if the two were set at the same height? Wouldn't you have to adjust the standards' measurements accordingly?

Yes. The bar does sit approx 1.5 cm lower with the new design. The rules still require any record or qualifying mark be measured (consult your rule book for details about each organization).

In the real world, old or new bar, you should check your standards for accuracy. If the pads the standards are mounted to are off the scale will not be accurate. Some standards have feet that can be adjusted, others have a slide to allow the reading to be adjusted at the collar. In all cases a responsible coach or official would measure a bar (any bar) and know how close their set up is to the scale on the standard.

Dan,

We used the Gill crossbar/end at the Big Ten outdoor championships last year at the University of Illinois. They
were also used at Millrose this past month and again up in Boston this past week. I do agree, the bar seems to be
very athlete friendly as it sits lower on the pegs.

While this type of "end" may be new to Gill, it has been used in Europe for over ten years. It's documented in all three
rule codes as valid for use, so I'd say it's not going away anytime soon. The only place it's not shown as an alternative end
is in the NFHS rule book.

At your Penn State meet ... how far apart (peg to peg) were your standards? They should be between 4.30m to 4.37m
(I know you know that). I've lost my measurement details I had on the length of these Gill bars, but nothing has changed
there, so that should be 4.50m +/- 2 cm and that would be from tip to tip. Personally, the bar definition specs need to be updated to show there are really two (actually) three independent pieces that make up the overall length of the bar now.

I wonder if we'll use them again in May at OSU?

Due to the # of calls about the new bar we created an info section on our website.

http://www.gillathletics.com/PV%20Website/Whats-Up.html

Dont foget to check out the technical download there as well.

If I am not mistaken it was used on hookers 19-10.5 jump and was very forgiving indeed!
close-up video of him going over shows it in action as he brushes it with his leg.