I Need of Beginning Pole Vaulting Advice

[Sebes]

I've just began helping some kids in high school with thier vaulting. I'm trying to teach them the basics: where to grip, running, planting on time...etc.

A problem I'm having is they suck their arms in at the take off instead of pushing them out. I'm not talking about a bent left arm...I'm talking about practically hugging the pole.

I'm thinking that they do this is because they have to. My girl can't bend the pole she's jumping on so her arm is forced to get sucked in. Does anybody have any advice for me? Me telling them over and over to push the arms out, keep them long....isn't working. And they're getting tired of jumping 7 to 8 feet.

Also, what do I do if they can't jump on poles that are at least their own weight?

The College level was easier,

Sebes

[rainbowgirl28]

Also, what do I do if they can't jump on poles that are at least their own weight?

Shorter poles.

[altius]

Buy BTB.

[Sebes]

I think I will pick up a copy

[AVC Coach]

Keep working with your kids and keep in mind that it's not a bad idea to learn fundamentals on a pole that does not bend. I know altius wants everyone to buy his book and that's a good idea too, but I would follow Becca's advice about getting some shorter poles rated at their body weight. You know they can actually learn faster on some poles rated below their weight. As they progress and get more confidence, you can gradually move them up one at a time.

[altius]

AVC coach -please note the reason I wrote BTB - is that a couple of years ago three boys were killed vaulting in the US. After going to Reno six times and watching what US vaulters at virtually every performance level were doing, I decided that many of them were putting themselves at risk because of a generally poor understanding of good technique in your country.
Of course you have great coaches - just not enough of them!

I dont give a tinkers whatever, if Americans buy the book or not - I dont need the money. Anyway I have had orders form Japan. taiwan, New Zealand, france, UK, Russia , Germany etc. However as a sports educator - not a coach please note -for the past 48 years, I cared about kids being killed doing something they loved.

You can always write your own book - i recommend it - it will help you clarify your thoughts - but now i really am outa here! [/code]

[AVC Coach]

altius,
Sorry if I offended you with my comment

"I know altius wants everyone to buy his book and that's a good idea too"

I can see where that horrible attack would elicit such a response. Sebes was simply asking for advice and instead of offering constructive, usable information, you just tell him to buy the book. You are a plethora of knowledge when it comes to the pole vault and all you have to offer is "Buy BTB"? It is a good book and I do own one. I would expect a little more thick skin from the guy who wrote a book with the name "Bubka" on the cover.

[altius]

Thats precisely the point AVC Coach. BTB has 178 pages of constructive, useful information which will be of more value to a beginning coach than a grab bag of tips and myths. Perhaps the problem is that the internet is now seen as a better source of information than older forms of media - in this case it is not.

Valuable as PVP is, it does not/cannot provide the comprehensive overview of this complex event in a form which makes it approachable to beginning coaches. If you have the time and energy to answer every question which has appeared on PVP in the last month - I envy you, because i have not. However if you take a look you will see I have contributed to some interesting discussions in recent days. The book answers the basic questions, PVP is a place to explore the unanswered questions.

[ADTF Academy]

I would expect a little more thick skin from the guy who wrote a book with the name "Bubka" on the cover.

It is amazing to me the number of people that expect some coaches to be mocking birds. How many times do we have to repeat things before we have the right to become tired. Every couple weeks or so new people come on here which is great don't get me wrong it means the sport is growing and they ask the same questions as thousands before. They either don't know any better or don't take the time to look through the countless posts that have already been made.

Alan's response to those continuous questions are published in a book. Hence why he wrote it. I agree, promote and encourage his response. "Buy BTB." If you want to know what Alan thinks buy his book. He has earned that previleage to have a book out there. If after you have read it you have more questons then ask him, but why should he responed to those that have not read his book? Would a professor in college help you if you didn't do your research, not where I went.

The internet has made to many people lazy. Simply put if you have a question instead of exploring and looking for the answer you simply expect someone to give it to you and when they won't you make the comment AVC Coach did.

It will be a sad day for us all when individuals cause the great minds of the sport to stop comming here because they are to stuck on themselves and feel everyone should be an open book. As much as I love the internet it will never beat raw hands on data and coaching. If you want to really know what someone is saying you need to work with them. If you want to really know what someone means you must read it in a book that contains all the information from start to finish not just on one tiny topic. The vault is progressive. If you want to know about one aspect you need to know about every aspect that takes place before it.

Alan coming from one coach to another I am glad your on here. I am glad you wrote BTB because it gives a starting point for conversations. I am glad you continuous come to the Summit even though many coaches don't think you should be there. In my opinion someone finally went out on a limb and wrote what they thought. Someone finally challenge the arrogance of American coaches and stired things up a bit. I know it gave me the opportunities I have now.

Find me another pole vault book that actually goes into as great of detail and does not simply give generic statements of the vault any coach or athlete could figure out. Show me another book that gives a path for young vaulters to follow from the very first moment you touch a pole till you are jumping higher. Show me another book please I would love to read it. Agree or don't agree with what he wrote at least he did it.

Agree or don't agree wit my comments thats up to you. But to tell another coach they need to have a little more thick skin from the guy who wrote a book with the name "Bubka" on the cover. That's simply sad and I hope you were having a bad day when you wrote that.

[AVC Coach]

If you want to know what Alan thinks buy his book. He has earned that previleage to have a book out there. If after you have read it you have more questons then ask him, but why should he responed to those that have not read his book? Would a professor in college help you if you didn't do your research, not where I went.

You make it sound as though the people that ask questions on this site are only asking Alan. I HAVE read the book and it is everything you described. Several of my vaulters have the book. In my opinion, it is the best pole vault book I've seen so far.

Nobody is questioning the usefullness of BTB or the validity of the author's expertise! And yes, I do have a lot of respect for Alan and what he has accomplished in his work. I probably did go overboard with the "thick skin" comment and I'll have to wait until my coffee kicks in at 5am before I get my cage rattled by an offensive response to one of my posts.

You have to keep in mind that the majority of users on this site are young athletes with loads of energy, a ton of questions and zero patience. You can't fault them for that. I coach 7th - 12th grade kids everyday, so I'm kind of used to it. If you or anyone else sees a post that seems redundant, you don't have to answer it.

[ADTF Academy]

I know the questions are not geared to anyone person and anyone is open to answer them.


Alan answered with Buy BTB.


It was you that challenged his response as though it was the wrong one to make and that he should have made a deeper response. As though you think people are only asking him. His deepest response is in my opinion his book.


I agree with the age group your working with they do have a million questions and I sometimes feel many young athletes and coaches make this sport to difficult on the young athletes. They give them to many technical things to think about and attempt to perform. The old notion of simple to complex seems to be done in reverse by some. They like to go learn the most complex things first and then some day you can learn the basics.


A catch 22

[altius]

Maaaatesss - We are all in this together and we will not always agree - and some days we get out of the wrong side of the bed and play grumpy old men - or women. Dont let us allow small misunderstandings to become any more than that!

i understand the enthusiasm of the young and their need for immediate practical answers for the problems they face BUT many of the questions posed canot be answered in easy one liners because as we know the vault in totally integrated from first step to the landing on the pad. How can you give a vaulter advice on how to invert when you have not the slightest idea of what their run and take off is like.

Similarly how can you give a new coach the advice they need - in a few words - when you have no idea of the context in which they are coaching or what their prior background in sport or life is?.

I should have made my position clear before - sorry i didnt.